"Providing Student Services to Distance
Learners"
Transcript of Trends in Electronic Student
Services Webcast
Slide: WCET Presents a Webcast Series:
Providing Student Services to Distance Learners
PAT: Hello, and welcome
to the WCET webcast series, providing student services to
distance learners. I am Pat Shea, the Assistant Director for
WCET. And I'm coming to you today from our east coast office
in Summit, New Jersey. Also joining us from WCET's headquarters
in Boulder, Colorado, is my colleague Sue Armitage. Welcome,
Sue.
SUE: Hello, Pat, and
everyone in the audience. Our host, HorizonLive, would like
to know if you in the audience have participated in a HorizonLive
session before. Please look at your screens and find the green
"yes" and the red "no" button. Please
go ahead now and click on the appropriate button to indicate
whether you are a HorizonLive veteran or not.
PAT: And those buttons
are in the black bar, right underneath the screen.
SUE: Yes, above your
picture, Pat.
PAT: Right. So, it looks
like we have a number of people who've been here before, but
a number who have not experienced this. So we'll try to give
you some tips as we're moving through the beginning here,
so you are comfortable with this new environment.
Slide: Trends in Electronic Student
Services With Darlene Burnett
PAT: Our special guest
today is Darlene Burnett, a consultant in higher education
to IBM, where she heads up its best practice partners in student
services initiative. Darlene will be talking with us today
about trends in electronic student services. Welcome, Darlene,
and how is it there in Cary, North Carolina?
DARLENE: Thank you,
Pat, and hello. It's a beautiful day. I was just chatting
with some of the folks in our message box that we're having
a beautiful fall day. I'm delighted to be here and what I'd
like to do is start by asking our attendees to get acquainted
and start using the chat box. I've been chatting with several
of the folks and I notice that we still have a lot that are
talking. But I'd like for you just to indicate, if you haven't
already, which institution or organization you're with.
SUE: And where you're
located.
DARLENE: And where you're
located. Thank you, Sue.
SUE: Well, I've been
looking at the list so far and we have people from all over.
Alaska, Utah, Idaho, North Carolina, Houston, Arizona, Vermont,
California, North Dakota, Ohio and Chicago. So welcome, everybody.
We're awfully glad that you're here.
DARLENE: Well, it looks
like we have about forty-four folks that responded yes and
no to the question. And I'd like to just encourage you to
keep using the chat box as we're doing the presentation. So
if there's information that comes up that you'd like to discuss,
or just from your experiences that you'd like to share with
the other listeners on the session.
PAT: Okay, that's great.
And if you experience connectivity problems during this presentation,
please call HorizonLive, and let me give you a number that
you can jot down so that you'll have it. That number is 877-825-5810.
Again, the number is 877-825-5810. Or you can click on the
help button to send an email message to tech support.
SUE: And there are a
lot of people online today, and if you'd like to send a private
message to one of the people online, you're welcome to do
so. You see in the block bar there's a "Tell" icon. Click
on "Tell," write a message, and only the person that you select
will be able to see your message.
Question: Are you primarily interested
in service for students located off-campus, on campus, or
a combination of both?
PAT: Okay, so to get
a better sense of your interest today, we'd like to put a
question up in the dialogue box, going to have you respond
to it. And it's, "Are you primarily interested in services
for students located off-campus, on campus or a combination
of the two?" So if you'll respond to that question on your
screen. I'll give you just a second or so. And while you're
responding to that, I want to tell you that this webcast,
Trends in Electronic Student Services is the second in our
series on providing student services to distance learners.
This series is brought to you by WCET in partnership with
HorizonLive and I understand Brendan, who's on here providing
some technical support, that HorizonLive was named best of
the breed this week by US News and World Report. So congratulations.
Each month through June, except for December, we will have
a webcast on a different student service. So we'll hope that
you'll join us on some of those future webcasts as well. Okay,
Susan, do you have some results here that you can tell us
about?
SUE: This is interesting
technology. I'm sorry it took me a little time because I'm
working through it — I'm sorry.
DARLENE: Well, we have
fifty-two "yes" responses and one "no"
response. I'm wondering if folks used the "yes/no"
button.
PAT: It's possible.
I see the box at the top of the screen there in the magenta
area, if you would enter your response to that question. Ah,
there you go.
Question Results
SUE: There we go. So
everybody can look at the responses, as we look at the question.
Off-campus, on campus or combination. So it looks like it's
off-campus or a combination as the primary area of interest.
DARLENE: Okay. That's
good to know. We'll I'll make sure that I move my remarks
or make sure my remarks cover those areas.
Slide: WCET, the Cooperative advancing
the effective use of technology in higher education.
PAT: Okay, and for those
of you who are not familiar with WCET, it's a cooperative
of higher education institutions, agencies, non-profit organizations
involved in distance learning. Our focus is on advancing the
effective use of technology in higher education. And you'll
see on the screen some more information about WCET and also
the website address where you can find even more information.
I will call your attention to the fact that we do have an
annual conference coming up called eRevolution and EDU, which
will be held in Coeur d'Alene, Idaho. It starts on Halloween
and goes through November 3rd, and there will be a number
of student services presentations there.
Slide: Trends in Electronic Student
Services "Best Practices"
PAT: So now, it's time
to properly introduce our guest Darlene Burnett. Darlene began
researching best practice models about seven years ago in
her work with IBM. Prior to joining IBM, Darlene worked at
Pittsburgh State University at the University of Kansas, and
at Johnson County Community College. Darlene received a BS
in Business Administration with majors in Computer Information
Systems and Accounting from Pittsburgh State University, and
an MBA in Organizational Behavior from the University of Missouri.
She has written widely on the topic of best practices in student
services. Okay. And now Darlene.
Slide: From Transactions to Relationships
DARLENE: Thank you very
much. I'm delighted to be with you today and, again, just
keep those questions coming in if there's something you'd
like for me to talk about. I'd like to start today on this
first slide by discussing an over-arching trend that we've
begun to identify. There's a book by Joseph Pine and James
Gilmore called The Experience Economy. And in that book they
start to focus on how in delivering services to students or
to consumers in general we're starting to move away from a
focus on transactions and we're moving to a focus on relationships.
And in doing that, the shift is really from a service economy
that is transactional to an experience economy that's relational.
Slide: What is a "Best Practice" in
Student Services?
DARLENE: So as we look
at the services in a one-stop center, and I talk about added
value or we talk about services in Web portals and Web services
in a fourth generation, I'm really starting to talk about
that experience level. On this chart, I'm starting to identify
now some of the focus areas for best practices and student
services. There's twenty-three institutions that have been
identified by IBM as having models of best practices in student
services. Some are one-stop centers, some use technology.
But the key is that each of them has contributed some of the
unique innovations. And out of those models, what we have
identified is that the trend that runs through there, the
best practice model, there is a focus on the customer or student
satisfaction and success.
When I say "customer" I know that that's not a
comfortable term or a common term that's used with the university
or a college, but the twenty-three institutions have all made
that switch and they truly view the service portion interaction
with their students and they view them as a customer. And
in doing so, they have changed how they view that interaction.
And instead of viewing that interaction from the institutional
view, they have inverted it and they view it from the student
view, and they have redesigned their processes as such. And
added value is a core word, and this added value is what creates
the relationship around the transaction.
When you are in a face-to-face environment delivering service,
the student wants the person to be able to answer the question
the first time correctly and they want them to be able to
answer a range of questions. The last one is choice. The students
want the ability to choose a time, place and service context.
Slide: What is a "Best Practice" in
Student Services? Self Service, Empowered front line staff,
Cross-functional teams, Institutional strategy, Executive
commitment
DARLENE: As we look
at the additional focus areas for best practice in student
area services, we come to three choices: self-service, generalist
and specialist. And the students, when they choose, 70% of
the time will choose self-service. And this is your on-campus
student; 20% will choose generalist and 10% will choose or
need specialist.
Slide: Old Process New Process
DARLENE: And when I
say generalist, I don't mean the generalist in terms of general
knowledge, but the person has a breadth of knowledge, a wide
range of knowledge. Some institutions are using that as an
area to promote specialist because of the training and the
wide range of knowledge that's required.
Slide: What is a "Best Practice" in
Student Services? Self Service, Empowered front line staff,
Cross-functional teams, institutional strategy, Executive
commitment
DARLENE: The chart you
were just seeing on your screen, the inverted pyramid, demonstrated
the old service model and how we're moving to the new service
model, where the majority of interactions were from the specialist,
and now the majority of interactions will be with auto-transactions
and self-service. In addition, the two key focus areas that
are a requirement to be a successful best practice —
and by that I mean that it's for you to be able to sustain
the project and have the support, it really needs to be a
key part of the institutional strategy and it also needs to
have your executive cabinet the support and commitment. That
seems to be a differentiator and between a successful project
and one that never quite reaches success. I'd like to ask
a question now and I'd like for you to answer a question.
I'd like to know if your institution has a physical one-stop
center, and, if so, is it part of your institutional strategy
for service? And if you just type in your chat box, that would
be great
Slide: Institutions Recognize the Need
to Change
DARLENE: And while we're
getting those responses back, whether you have a physical
one-stop center, I'd like to take a look at the next slide,
which discusses the traditional model for student services.
In the traditional model for student services, the one that
we certainly all grew up in when we went to college, the student
is moved from physical building to physical building. And
within those physical buildings, there's three streams of
services that I've depicted: enrolment services, academic
support services, and student support services. And in those
streams of services, we have offices and individuals, so you
can start to see just pictorially the number of individuals
and the number of places that we physically move our students
to.
Now, this is one of those parallels that I want you to make
the jump from physical one-stop center to electronic services.
What I've noticed is that the majority of institutions, when
they start delivering electronic student services over the
Web, they replicate the physical model. They replicate the
physical silos, they replicate the physical offices, and we
move the students virtually around the website the same way
that we have been moving them around the physical center.
And, of course, we have a history and a tradition of why we
do it on campus, but we don't have those restrictions or barriers
on the Web.
So keep that in mind, it's one of the over-arching principles
of relationship, in addition to transaction, that the Web
doesn't have those restrictions.
Well, it looks like we have a lot of the responses in and
I would say that, by and large, it looks like the majority
do not have physical one-stop centers.
SUE: I would agree,
just looking at it. And we've got a nice number of yeses,
but I think the majority is no.
PAT: Let me ask you this
Darlene. A number of campuses, though, have created one-stop
centers, and then go on to create a center on the Web. Is
it possible for institutions to skip the phase of creating
the physical one-stop center and just move directly into creating
a virtual one-stop center on their website?
DARLENE: Absolutely.
Even if you look at the list of the Twenty-three Best Practice
Institutions some of them started with the physical one-stop
centers, and some of them started with the Web portals and
the Web services. What's interesting to note, and what you
might not have expected and one that I didn't expect, was
that those institutions that started with the physical one-stop
centers, it was a natural transition to flow into Web portals
and Web services. University of Delaware, Boston College,
two examples that started ten years ago. But what I hadn't
anticipated was the University of Minnesota was really one
of our first Web portals and did an outstanding job, beginning
about six years ago. They have, in the last year, been looking
at creating physical one-stop centers. So you can start in
either place, but then it seems that the traditional students'
demand will require that you have both. So even if you're
focusing on electronic student services, if you need in-person
interaction, at some point you'll need to consider it.
PAT: I see. Good to
know.
Slide: What are the Trends?
DARLENE: Well, let's
take a look at some of the trends. There's about six trends
that I'd like to focus on. The first three focuses on culture.
And this is another one of those key areas that you need to
consider when you're implementing or initiating a project.
And that's the culture shift. One of the most difficult things
about this type of project, when you're trying to create a
student-centered service environment, is that you need to
change the view from the internal view to the external view.
From what the institution needs to what the student needs.
And that 180 degree shift, that filter or vision, every question
you ask about the service should be from that context. What
does the student need? How would we interact with the student?
The second trend is the interaction, and we've spoken about
that briefly, in making sure that you're moving from just
a focus on transactions to creating a very positive experience
and building that relationship. It also needs to be strategic.
If we look at the last three trends, there's a shift from
individual departments to institution Web-wide portals. When
you're working with students, and their interaction with the
institution is on the Web, and they're doing all electronic
services, it becomes extremely important that there is a Web-portal
strategy for the institution so that every Web page they click
on has the same look and feel, has the same navigation, has
the same branding. That becomes absolutely critical when that's
their primary interaction with the institution. And the branding
most institutions have a focus on the print material. They
have criteria. They have reviews. But we don't have those
things in place for the Web. I mean, we kind of started up
bootstrap on the Web operations, and so those things haven't
been put in place yet. But you really need to consider that
for the level of focus that you all have with electronic student
services.
And the last is the service delivery. We're no longer just
focusing, you know, on the job change, but we're really focusing
on how do we sustain these changes once we have a different
way about doing this?
Question: Are your institution's student
service initiatives part of a institution-wide strategic plan
or departmental?
DARLENE: Well, at this
point I'd like to hear from you about your student-service
initiatives. Are they part of the strategic plan for your
institution, or are they departmental? And if you would pick
the radio button on your screen and vote, that would be great.
I don't think this discussion will be on CD, but you can go
in on the archive and look at this information.
PAT: Yes, we'll have
it accessible from our website for about one year from today.
SUE: Well, it'll probably
take a couple of days to be archived and made available, but
we'll be up there for a long time.
DARLENE: And there's
a question of ROI information on your technical investment.
Louisiana State University has done an outstanding job with
their Web portal and doing an ROI study on the results. And
they've done that study in terms of how much more service
they're able to deliver for the same cost. And so that you
may want to look or talk with someone there. And also WCET
has some information on technology, the Technology Methodology
Project looks at some of the Return On Investment, I think.
So that's another source of information.
DARLENE: Well it looks
like most people have indicated for me to go ahead and publish
the results.
Question Results:
Are your institution's student service initiatives part of
a institution-wide strategic plan or departmental?
DARLENE: It's very close
between institutional strategic plan and departmental. Reactions
are going on on both sides.
PAT: I think that's
very interesting. I think, sometimes, when you can begin at
the institutional-wide, strategic level, that's great. But
sometimes you have to start at the departmental level and
prove that it can be successful as a pilot before you can
move on to an institution-wide, strategic plan. Have you found
that to be the case, Darlene?
DARLENE: I have. And
in some cases, Pat, when you don't yet have the executive
cabinet support, sometimes it's very important to create a
departmental model and departmental prototype and then use
that as a basis for gaining the institution-wide support and
the executive cabinet support to make it strategic.
PAT: Okay.
Slide: Parallels and Lessons to be
Learned
DARLENE: Okay. Well,
let's take a look now, Pat, at some of the parallels and lessons
to be learned. One of the things that I wanted to do was to
share the experience of those that have been doing one-stop
physical centers for ten years, some of the knowledge and
experience they've gained, and the path that they've taken.
Those individuals and institutions have really focused on
the redesigned processes. And as they've moved into delivery
of electronic student services, what they found is that those
same philosophies apply to the electronic student services.
That it's very critical to redesign the processes electronically
for the virtual center as it is for the physical. And one
really key area that they've learned is — and they have
moved, and provided choice for their students, and 70% have
elected to do Web or self-service — what that means
now for those centers is that they've had to create email
and phone support centers. The generalists that are usually
on the front counter are now staffing the phone, and are also
staffing the email so that those students who are asking those
questions, electronically, are getting the same level of excellence
and the same level of information. In addition, they are focusing,
and have identified that they need to find ways of creating
the positive experience on the Web that they've managed to
create in that physical environment.
PAT: Darlene, when you
talk about redesigning student processes here, that takes
a lot of time to do that. I think for many institutions it's
easier for them to, sort of, Web-enize current services than
it is to really focus on redesigning services. And I think
to do that successfully, you really have to involve cross-functional
teams. Has that been your experience?
DARLENE: Well, you do,
because you really want an individual from each of the service
areas represented to help define that holistic view that the
student needs and wants. But I'll also tell you that if you
just Web-enize your traditional manner of delivering services,
it becomes very apparent when the student compares that interaction
on the Web with the interaction of another institution that
has done redesign. And then if you want to get to the fourth
generation of Web services, it really becomes important to
think and redesign how those services are delivered. I'd like
to pose another question to you.
Question: What services do you currently
have online?
DARLENE: What services
do you currently have online? I'm sure that you have a lot
of functionality already. I've gone on a lot of these websites,
or your websites, and seen what you have out there. But I
think it would be helpful to just get an idea from each of
you what you think are the key services, perhaps, that you
have online.
PAT: We'll give folks
just a minute or so to answer.
DARLENE: While answering
that question I'd like to provide a little information on
where I see the Web services heading. There was a report by
Gartner Group last year, and in that report they indicated
that about 5% of colleges and universities had Web portals.
And they also, based on their research, indicated that they
believe that in four more years, 2005, 80% of the colleges
and universities would have Web portals. Now, what that says
to me is that in 2000 and 2001, if you have a Web portal,
that's a differentiator and it gives you a competitive advantage
and that it is consistent with some of the really great consumer
sites that your students are used to using. But what that
also means, that in four more years, that's business as usual.
So you need to figure out how to go beyond Web portal and
transactions, and how to begin incorporating or leapfrog,
and add all of the relationship and experience elements into
delivery of electronic student services.
PAT: How are we doing
on the responses, Sue?
SUE: Not a whole lot
of people responded but we can go ahead and look what they
have to say. Information only, information, that's registration,
orientation library. Barbara Beringer says, "All service is
excellent."
PAT: So it looks like
what we have here is what WCET has found earlier is that a
lot of the administrative core kinds of services are the first
services that are up on the Web. And then the other services
like academic advising, counseling, orientations tend to follow.
Okay.
DARLENE: Well, that
looks like we've got some transactional information out there.
There's quite a bit of functionality.
Question Results: What services do
you currently have online?
DARLENE: It looks like
it's probably starting with enrollment management courses
which is pretty consistent. Well, I'd like to now switch to
the electronic student services focus, specifically, and talk
about what I've learned, or how I see the evolution is moving
through the four generations.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services
Covers Four Distinct Generations
DARLENE: And this first
generation is what I consider the replication of the physical,
traditional environment. The focus is on content, it's internal
view of the institution. It's internal vocabulary. The one
word that I pull out that I think really helps define this,
is the word, "bursar." The word, "bursar" isn't an everyday
word that a student would use. And they have to learn what
that means when they interact with an institution. So we use
those different words in the vocabulary, not only in speaking
with the student, but also what we've put on the Web. So let's
move to our first example. The first generation Web portal.
Slide: Generation 1 Displays Content
in an Easy to Find Manner
DARLENE: This is an
actual home page of an institution. I've taken the name of
the institution off so that it won't be apparent. But what
you'll see when you look at this front page, their home page,
is that everything is divided into silos. It's all internal
language. It's internal view. And it replicates the traditional,
physical environment. And it's all perfectly good information,
but the student is used to interacting with consumer sites
that really focus on experience.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services
Covers Four Distinct Generations — Generation 2 highlighted
DARLENE: So let's take
a look at generation two and see how the service has evolved.
And I'll show you some examples of that. In generation two,
we move from just content to putting the content within context.
And so in the context area we might have prospective students.
Slide: Generation 2 Displays Information
by Customer and Content
DARLENE: And let's take
a look at an example of a generation two, and I've selected
the University of Delaware. This is their homepage. So the
first thing a student or parent would see when they go to
University of Delaware, this is their homepage. And on the
right, it has the context. Prospective students, current students,
parents and alumni. So if I were to select prospective students,
it would have all of the content for prospective students
in one place for me. And so now we're starting to, at least,
filter all of that information and help the user get what
they need. If we look at the next slide.
Slide: Generation 2 Displays Information
by Customer and Content — Student Central
PAT: A sort of a group
of paths through the website.
DARLENE: It is. We're
looking at a looking group level. We're looking at the generic
student. And another example is the University of Texas at
Austin, and this happens to be their current student. So they
have collected the information that a current student would
need, but you probably can't read the small print, but what
I'd like for you to think about or talk about on this one
is that under admissions, it's "Apply for admissions," "Check
your status," "Find an in-state transfer," "Class registration,"
"To see the registration," "Register for a class," and, "Paying
a fee receipt," "View my class schedule," you'll notice that
this is switched to all action words. We're telling the student
what they need to do. We're stating to put a focus on profit
and that's very different than just having the words and the
content there.
PAT: So you can see
the beginnings of a relationship starting to form.
DARLENE: Exactly. We're
adding value now to this information. We're helping guide
the student just a bit. Okay, well, let's look at generation
three.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services
Covers Four Distinct Generations — Generation 3 highlighted
DARLENE: Now generation
three is what I consider the true portal. It has personalization,
customization and community. It still focuses on transactions,
but it has those elements. At generation two it's a collection
of students and in generation three, it's me as an individual:
it's my information. So let's look at an example of personalized
and customized.
Slide: Generation 3 Displays Information
that is Customized and Personalized and Creates a One-Stop
Virtual Center
PAT: Now, Darlene, when
you say personalized and customized, by personalized you mean
for me, the individual, it's a message directly to me, with
my information, and by customized you mean I can put whatever
information I want on that particular Web page?
DARLENE: That's exactly
what it means. It's my grades, my financial information, my
personal address and personal information. And the customization
is that I get to choose what items are going to be on the
screen and I'll show you an example of that in a minute. What
we're looking at now is the University of Minnesota. And there's
a couple of points I wanted to make on this website. The first
was about branding. You'll notice that they have the ticket,
the one-stop "M" ticket? That's their branding.
The University of Minnesota has created a set of criterion
standards, and if anyone wants to include their services in
the virtual one-stop center, they have to meet the standards
and criteria and then they get to use that one-stop ticket
on their page. Now, if you're looking at that and you see
student, faculty and staff, and that was all that we saw,
that's generation two, because that's a collection of generic
individuals and it's just general content. But when we go
to my one-stop, that's my personal information and that's
what we would have on the student page.
Slide: Customized and Personalized
One-Stop Virtual Center
DARLENE: Let's take
a look at the University of Texas Austin again. The University
of Texas Austin, this is the home page. This is my one-stop.
This is my Web portal. And what I want to bring you attention
to here is the consistency of branding, the consistency, the
look and feel, navigation on the left, so they have a consistent
navigation. They have the left column that has the different
information that you might need. But under campus information,
that's where you get to customize what you want on your website.
And under the Texas Daily, you get to choose what you want
to see there. But the navigation is consistent from page to
page. The look and feel is consistent from page to page, and
it's my personal information. And they also will push or publish
information to me based on my individual set of needs.
PAT: This would be a
good time, Darlene, to pose a question from the chat box.
There's a concern over the security and privacy of information
that people post or include in their own page.
DARLENE: Yes.
PAT: Do you have any
concerns about privacy and security of personal information?
DARLENE: Well, privacy
is a critical issue on all of the campuses and for those institutions
that have implemented the virtual one-stop centers, they've
had to deal with the authentication, one log-on, one ID, and
how they would validate that the individual does have access
to that. So, they've all addressed that and I haven't heard
of any of them, other than just the one or two cases where
someone has left a screen up or someone has printed out a
page with their password on it. But I haven't really heard
of any problems with security of the personal information.
PAT: And it looks like
Chris Brooker says, "By utilizing a secure authentication,
they've managed to provide more security."
DARLENE: Excellent.
PAT: So it looks like
some of the folks on the website are sharing information about
how they've handled that problem also.
DARLENE: Well, Pat,
let's take a look at the next slide, LSU.
Slide: LSU PAWS — Customized
and Personalized One-Stop Virtual Center — Community
PAT: Now, is that Louisiana
State University?
DARLENE: It is. Louisiana
State University and they have a one-stop portal also. And
again, my definition of portal, it's personalized, customized,
has community and has a large range of transactions. On the
left is "My Desktop," and it's too small for you to read the
detail, but it has all of the functions that I might want
to perform, so I could locate people, publish information,
course information. But this is an example of their chat or
their discussion or their community. And it's a great example
of how you can start to help use the technology to create
relationships.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services
Covers Four Distinct Generations — Generation 4 highlighted
DARLENE: Okay, let's
take a look at generation four. Generation four is where all
of you will want to go with the delivery of your electronic
student services. If 2004 is the target when 80% of your peers
will have Web portals, you need to be thinking now about how
you design into those Web services and portals that high touch,
high tech relationship and experience. So let's look at our
first example.
PAT: Darlene, is this
where you start to see some artificial intelligence involved
in these sites?
Slide: Generation 4 Creates High Touch/High
Tech
DARLENE: Well, it is,
Pat. At this point, when you start to get the high touch,
high tech, it probably is the best example that everyone would
know about would be Amazon.com. I'm sure many of the folks
online have used Amazon.com and you've bought a book, you've
bought a CD, and Amazon.com will you know, talk about data
mining or artificial intelligence, they will mine that information
about you so that the next time you come online, they'll present
you with other CDs by the same artist or other CDs in the
same genre or same genre of books or the same author. So you
start to learn about the individual's preferences, interests
and then you present information to them.
So the commercial sites and models have some excellent examples
that we might think about picking up and using for education.
And you have on the screen now the criteria for the fourth
generation. It goes back to what we learned about, the one-stop
centers, it has process orientation: we're guiding the students
through it. It's a holistic view. We create decision-making
guides. We're presenting personalized recommendations for
their enrollment schedule. We're presenting personalized recommendations
within their major. It's proactive communication. Happy birthday
cards. It's based on whether you're about ready to become
a junior; you haven't selected your major. You need to file
for graduation. That's where we start mining, to find out
the individual needs and interests and then pushing that information
back and creating enhanced communities.
Slide: Generation 4: High Touch/High
Tech UT Austin — Decision Making Guide
DARLENE: Well, let's
take a look at our first example of generation four. And I'm
going to go back to UT Austin again. They've done an excellent
job with the electronic services that they've created. And
the example I've pulled out is a job search. But it really
is a good example of a decision support tool, in that they
focus on the job interest, the salary, the date, the time,
and that helps narrow or put on filters for all the data that's
out there. There's a wealth of data out on the website, and
you really need to help the student narrow it to what applies
to them. This might be applied to housing searches, parking
searches, class schedule searches, major searches.
PAT: I would love to
see a guide out there for helping students find their major.
I have a couple of daughters who could make good use of that.
So if anybody in our chat box has some suggestions for a good
Web resource in that regard I'd be very interested in it.
DARLENE: Does anyone
have a decision-support tool out there now for students? And
if so, on what topic? I'd like to see that appear in the chat
box.
Slide: Generation 4: High Touch/High
Tech BYU — Decision Making Guide
DARLENE: Let's look
at our next example while some of those are coming in. Brigham
Young University has an example and, Pat, this goes along
with what you were talking about — helping your daughters
choose a major.
PAT: Yes.
DARLENE: They've created
a worksheet for freshman. And on that worksheet for freshman,
it has a step-by-step guide — so you can see there's
five steps that it's going to guide them through — but
they also have all of the resources and all of the contacts
that they would need to help them build and define their first
semester. So it's an excellent way of helping create that
decision tool, providing a very positive experience, and also
starting to form that relationship. You're going well beyond
just the transaction of the information.
PAT: Very interesting.
Slide: University of Delaware —
Prospective Students
DARLENE: Okay, let's
look at another guide in the University of Delaware prospective
students. I've pulled this off of the prospective students
and I'm just showing one page. But you can start to see that
they have a step-by-step guide. I go from prospective students
to prospective undergraduate students. And if I chose the
undergraduate it would continue offering me choices, and then
would continue funneling me down the line, helping me move
from point to point until I got all of the information I needed.
So that would be a step-by-step guide.
Slide: Generation 4: High Touch/High
Tech — U of Minnesota Student Admissions Workbench Enhanced
Community
DARLENE: Now, the next
example is University of Minnesota. And I wanted to switch
gears here just a bit. We've been talking about students and
improving services for students and creating the student-centric
view. But what's important, and what we discovered in looking
at the physical centers, is — and most of the institutions
discovered very early on — is when you're focusing on
improving services for students, you also have to provide
equal attention and focus on improving the ability of staff
to deliver those services. So, with electronic student services,
how are you going to train and support the staff to answer
email or phone? How are you going to provide that general
range of knowledge? How are you going to create cross-functional
teams to help define and build those services? In this example,
this is the student admissions workbench. You can choose cohorts,
you can build in reports. You can see down on the bottom you
can choose the kind of reporting mechanism you want. But it
becomes a workbench to help you better work with a student
in that area. So that becomes a very, very important area.
PAT: I think that's
absolutely critical, Darlene. Many campuses start with redesigning
their student services from the students' point of view, and
that certainly should be the driving force. But I think we
have to balance that with providing the staff with the right
tools to respond to students. I mean, you can design incredibly
wonderful student services, but if you don't give staff the
tools they need to provide those services — it just
won't happen.
DARLENE: Well, and that's
another one of those very important critical success factors.
You know, you can have all of the best-laid plans, but if
you haven't helped the people who are going to support and
implement it equally, you're going to have a very tough time
of sustaining it and also being successful.
Slide: University of North Carolina
Online Personal Assistants
DARLENE: Well, let me
show you another example of high relationship, high experience.
This is the University of North Carolina at Greensboro. And
on the left you can see that they have a "UNCG Online" button.
And when you punch that button, you'll get a chat box. And
that chat box will bring up a generalist and that generalist
will — live, as we are now — respond to the student's
questions. But when you have someone out on the Web, they
may or may not have access to the phone, but they do have
access to the Web, so how are you going to start staffing
and then presenting that information for them to create that
live added-value service chat?
PAT: And is that staffed
by staff, volunteers or students?
DARLENE: It's staffed
by a generalist. And one of the things that they do is the
generalists have decided to build an FAQ log, so that as they
get questions from the students, they're entering that information
so that anyone who responds will provide the same answer and
consistency. And that becomes, then, a valuable tool for the
staff.
Slide: UC Gateways
DARLENE: Well, let's
look at the next example which is UC Gateway. This is the
University of California Gateways project. This focuses on
the under-served student and it's a portfolio. And in the
portfolio, they have the ability to contact their success
team. So they've built a relationship with three staff members.
They have their phone number, their email, and they have their
test scores, their backpack. They're helping this group of
students prepare to go to college. These are first-time college
or, first-time students. They're eighth to twelfth grade.
No family member has gone to college. So they really need
help. So this is a outstanding example of how you would start
to form relationship and how you would really create that
positive experience that would help with retention, would
help with recruiting, would help with yield, would help with
any number of things for a cohort you wanted to target.
PAT: Darlene, is this
gateway project, is this the one associated with Francisco
Hernandez?
DARLENE: It is. It's
the University of California at Santa Cruz is the prototype
model.
PAT: Oh, that's great.
He's going to be our luncheon speaker at the annual conference
in Coeur d'Alene on November 2nd. We'll have to ask him about
it.
DARLENE: You will. He'll
have some really nice stories for you about that.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services
Covers Four Distinct Generations
DARLENE: Well, let's
quickly review the four areas of evolution of Web services.
The first generation focuses on content, so that's your physical
silos, institutional perspective, institutional vocabulary.
It's usually the starting point, but you want to try to move
off of that fairly quickly. Generation two focuses on who
— perspective students; then what. It still is institutional
views, still perspective, but you can start to get the action
words in there. Generation three, you're at a true portal.
Personalized, customized community. It's focused on transactions.
And then generation four is where you start adding relationship
and experience and high touch, and that focuses on how and
it's guided and data mining — it's all of those elements
that you start to provide.
Question: What generation best describes
your current Web services?
DARLENE: I'd like to
ask a question here and I'd like to ask the individuals to
respond which generation they think best describes their current
electronic student services, and I'd like them to pick one
of the four generations.
PAT: I think there's
also an "other" option, because there might be schools
that are hybrids.
DARLENE: Okay.
PAT: When your not completely
in one of the four generations.
DARLENE: And after you've
done that — after you've selected one, two, three, four,
other — I'd like for you to go to the chat box and in
the chat box I'd like for you to let me know if there's other
institutions that you would recommend that you believe have
excellent models and should be recognized as best practices
in electronic services.
While we're collecting that information, I'd like to focus
on an area of consumer Web portals, and let me talk just a
bit about that while we still have this on the screen. This
is, again, the lessons learned. I like to focus on the lessons
learned so we don't reinvent the wheel and we share the information
learned. In the commercial websites, from Digital Magazine,
they did a study and one of the problems with the Web services,
they all have on their Web — here's an email that if
you have a question email, if you want something, email. Well,
56% of those websites didn't answer the email within forty-eight
hours. And 54% didn't answer the email at all. So when you're
trying to focus on customer satisfaction, student satisfaction,
student success, if you have an email and you're asking the
student to communicate in that manner, it becomes very important
that you have a process and you have criteria and you have
measurements to know how you're doing in that area because
it will become a dis-satisfier.
Question Results: What generation best
describes your current Web services?
PAT: Okay, Sue, do you
have some results? Oh, here we go.
DARLENE: Okay, so 56%
are in Generation two. That's great. And 9% in Generation
three Web portal. And it looks like about 7% have some fourth
generation services, which are excellent. I'd love to find
out what you have in there. I'll have an email up later and
anybody who wants to email me that, that'd be super. I'd love
to collect that information. And let's see, it looks like,
also, that they're suggesting to check out the University
of Michigan, at MSU. UCLA has a great portal, "My UCLA." Columbia
Teachers University threaded discussions. Oh, Central Piedmont
Community College. I wonder what they have? That sounds great.
Online development at Houston Community College. Wow. Okay,
I'd love to hear more about those and find out what you're
doing, because I'm always looking for new examples and new
models. And as well as I'm sure Pat is.
PAT: Absolutely.
DARLENE: Pat, do you
have any comments here?
PAT: No. I'm delighted
to see these and I hope people will continue to add some as
we move along here.
Slide: Disney.com
DARLENE: Okay, well,
let's take a look now at some consumer sites. And there's
four consumer sites I'd like to discuss. Amazon.com, iQVC,
eBay and Disney. Disney is customer satisfaction, eBay customer-friendly,
QVC overall and Amazon overall. I won't show examples of Amazon.com
overall, but just a brief Disney. When you go to the Disney
site, does this equate to their brand or what? I mean, it's
perfect. This is the experience of Disney replicated on the
website. It's not about transaction, it's about experience.
Slide: QVC home page
DARLENE: Okay. Let's
move to the QVC website and I wanted to show you there the
live chat. And we're doing a bit of that today so I won't
spend a lot of time, but you could chat with the advisor,
the chat with the financial aide, chat with the majors, chat
with different groups, to make it more personal with the electronic
student services.
Slide: Lands End - My Personal Shopper
DARLENE: One of my personal
favorites is Land's End. And Land's End, the first screen
that I want to show you, they provide a choice, up front,
of how you choose to interact with them. Well, let's see,
it looks like we're on Personal Shopper on 43. Okay?
PAT: And say you want
to go shop with a friend?
DARLENE: Let's do 42
for just a second.
PAT: Okay.
DARLENE: Okay. On this
one, this is where we're choosing whether we phone or chat.
So, you need to consider how you're going to communicate with
your students, how you're going to interact with them live
while they're doing electronic student services. And then
the next one, My Personal Shopper, I want you to think about
how you might create My Personal Advisor or My Personal Schedule,"
how do you use that data mining and AI to present information?
In this example, on slide 43, they're taking My Personal Shopper
— I answer a series of questions about my preferences
in clothing, style, color, size, and then they present back
to me those clothing items that would fit the description,
and then I can choose from those. And I think that's just
a dynamite way where we start using decision guides and some
of this data mining to start — not just presenting them
information, but helping them direct the information.
On the next slide, 44, Shop with a Friend, I wanted to present
this just to have you think about what you might do, how might
you use this? You might use this with Enroll with a Friend,
Find Housing with a Friend, Commute with a Friend, Study with
a Friend online. How might you allow more than one person
to go through a process at the same time? Now, one of the
things I'd like to find out at this point is what other commercial
websites do you think have excellent examples that people
should be considering when they're building models for their
electronic student services?
PAT: Christina had already
beat you to the punch, Darlene.
DARLENE: Oh.
PAT: She talked about
Nike.
DARLENE: Excellent.
DARLENE: Are there any
others that are out there for commercial sites that we should
be considering?
Slide: IBM Best Practice Partners
DARLENE: Okay. Well,
this is a list of the institutions that have been identified
as best practice models. There's twenty-three of them. And
we host a conference once a year — it was last August
at Tufts University. We'll hold one again next August. And
we'll also continue to add institutions to this list as we
focus on best practice models and student services.
PAT: Okay, we've got
some more answers, besides Nike. Toys'R'Us, Drugstore.com,
Eddie Bauer...
DARLENE: Oh, good. I'll
have to go look at those. That's always exciting to find new
models and then pick out parts that we might apply to the
student services electronic student services. Okay. Well,
they're putting up on the screen my contact information, so
if any of you have questions, feel free to email me or to
phone me, whatever is most convenient. It looks like my email's
up there.
Slide: Questions
PAT: And, Darlene, I
think you have a book coming out that has chapters in it by
a number of the best practice partners. Do you want to tell
us a little bit about that?
DARLENE: Yes, it's a
case studies book. Each of the best practice institution and
partner members will be discussing their lessons learned,
their critical success factors and their models. And that
should be out in February of 2002. It'll be published by SCUP.
And SCUP is a Society for College and University Planning,
and I have their website listed here also.
PAT: Okay. That's great.
Well, on behalf of WCET, and all of our attendees, thank you,
Darlene for an excellent presentation. I think there've been
some exciting new trends that you've pointed out to us today
and it looks like we have lots of work ahead in order to get
to this new relationship environment, both face-to-face and
electronic, if you're telling us that is the direction to
go.
DARLENE: Well, it's
exciting times and we finally have the technology that will
support this happening, so I'm really looking forward to hearing
about and seeing the new models that the institutions are
starting to provide.
Slide: This series is brought to you
as part of WCET's work on its Learning Anytime Anywhere Partnership
Project
PAT: Okay. Well, I'd
like everyone to know a little bit more about this webcast
series. It's been brought to you as part of WCET's work on
its learning anytime, anywhere partnership project called
Beyond the Administrative Core, Creating Web-based Student
Services for Online Learners. This project is funded by the
US Department of Education. Our special thanks go to our corporate
partner, HorizonLive, and especially Brendan Kehoe and Matt
Wasowski for making it possible to bring you these presentations
electronically.
Slide: Providing Student Services to
Distance Learners Webcast series
PAT: And if you'll go
to our website for additional information, you will see the
links to this webcast series. The URL is on the screen. And
there, you'll be able to register. And since this was recorded,
you can access the archives. Our next webcast will be November
14th at noon, Mountain Time. Mike Leonard from Penn State
University and the Chair of the Technology and Advising Commission
for the National Academic Advising Association...
DARLENE: Sue, do you
have any additional comments? I know we're going to plan to
stay on about another half hour if anyone wants to ask additional
questions.
SUE: Yes, well, I was
thinking as I was watching the comments in the chat box, a
lot of people asked for the URLs of the sites that you discussed
today, Darlene, and, in fact, we should go ahead and add those
to our WCET website. So, even though the pictures are kind
of small, it's because, you know, the window is only so big
- it's hard to see those sites and really explore them. So
hopefully, Darlene, you and I can figure out the URLs and
I'll include them.
DARLENE: We will.
SUE: People can check
them out.
DARLENE: In some cases,
we'll have to give you the contacts for the institution because
you'll need to get a guest ID. So once you get into the Web
portal, you'll need a guest ID to go in. And that's something,
when you're developing your electronic student services, I
suggest you plan and create a guest ID — that really
is very helpful.
Slide: Thank you for Joining Us
SUE: Okay. Well, now
is the time for the evaluation.
Question:
Evaluation Survey
SUE: It's very important
to us at WCET and HorizonLive to know what you think. We're
always trying to improve. So if you could take a couple of
minutes now to fill out the text boxes there on the evaluation
form, we'd really appreciate it. And Darlene, thank you for
your kind offer to stay online for a while and continue chatting
with people in the text box. I'll remind everybody that this
presentation has been recorded and it's going to be archived
and available on our website. But it's real nice though, to
stay online and be able to chat with the expert. So, thanks,
Darlene.
DARLENE: You're welcome.
I'm looking for questions.
SUE: Okay. While we're
doing that we still have quite a few folks online. Are any
of you in the process of redesigning your services that you
have that you're providing electronically? Are you going through
a redesign process? I'd be interested in which institutions
are actually going through a redesign process. The slides
are all available on the archive, as is the voice, as are
the comments. So you should have a complete replay on the
archives. In a couple of minutes, after I hope people have
finished the evaluation form, I'm going to put in that large
window the conference sites for the WCET conference. So people
who are interested can check that out.
DARLENE: Well, we're
getting really nice comments from everybody. Thank you very
much.
DARLENE: So, Weber State
is redesigning online support services. That's excellent.
I'd love to hear from you about what you're doing.
SUE: SorenG wonders
whether the archives are going to be on HorizonLive or WCET
or what? The answer is: it will be at the WCET website. It's http://www.wiche.edu/wcet. And you'll need to move from there to projects, and then to
"Beyond the Administrative Core."
DARLENE: I have a question.
It's BSU. Liz Ackerman. You say you're working on the redesign.
What services are you redesigning? All of the services? Enrolment
services or related services?
Slide: erevolution@edu
DARLENE: Bob, what is
it you'd like to know if it's going to be answered? I'm not
sure what your question is. I'll look back and see if I can
find it.
PAT: There's a question
on archives on HorizonLive or WCET. You can. you can access
them from the WCET website. They're actually held at HorizonLive.
DARLENE: Susan Smith,
what institution are you with? And Wayne needs the URL. Perhaps
you could type the URL in, Suse.
DARLENE: Okay. It just
hasn't scrolled onto my screen yet. There it is.
PAT: And from that URL,
people can check out the conference in Coeur d'Alene, they
can check out our particular Beyond the Administrative Core
project. There's lots of information and tools on our website,
and hope people start thinking of it as a go-to site for all
kinds of information.
PAT: And I think many
people should be seeing the program, right now for the annual
conference up on their screen.
SUE: Right.
PAT: And it's actually
a live link, so you can kind of browse through there and look
for some presentations on student services if you go to the
Services Track, you'll see what the presentations are going
to be all about.
DARLENE: And Catherine
to Northern Arizona, you're just designing your services and,
again, are those enrolment services, or enrolment plus related
services? And I guess, one of the questions I would also have,
are you designing for distance education students only or
are you designing students or, the electronic student services
for all students? Thanks, Kenneth W., on that information
North Carolina. I'll do that. I'll contact Dr. Cannoy and
the "@" isn't there.
PAT: I think one of
the one thing we found in a project in the in the lab project
that we're doing right now, that it's difficult to design
Web-based student services for the distance learner only because,
on a number of campuses, the online learners are in the dorms.
And so it takes on a different character and you need to look
at designing services that will really serve both students,
the traditional students in the dorm who are studying online,
and those students who can never come to campus. I wonder
if other folks in our audience have had a similar experience?
DARLENE: There is a
website that KennethW just mentioned: the CFNC.org, and I
would encourage everyone to go out and take a look at that
website. It is dynamite. It's the State of North Carolina
and they've just done an excellent, excellent job with that.
PAT: And I see Susan
Smith from Weaver State said that their focus is on designing
electronic services for all students. Not sure where Catherine
Helig is from. They are mostly focusing on distance education
students. And I think, sometimes, what happens in that case
is that to sort of lead the way for the campus to expand in
delivering services electronically for other students by demonstrating
the success of doing it for distance students.
DARLENE: Are there any
other questions that the folks that are still here would like
to ask specific to what you're trying to accomplish on your
campus, or the says that you're in within your campus, have
you run into any problems? One of the things that we didn't
discuss was not project management, but also dealing with
some of the human issues of change management. Okay, so we're
starting with students taking courses online, but on-campus
students take Pat, you were mentioning something about the
number of on-campus students taking distance education courses.
I thought that was pretty remarkable.
PAT: Yes. One of the
institutions we're working with in this project now, that
initially they thought they were going to design student services
for their distance students. But when they looked at the enrolment,
they found that 80% of their distance students, their online
learners, were living on campus. So I think, increasingly,
campuses are finding that.
DARLENE: Well you know,
I think that's pretty remarkable. I would not have ever guessed
that. But it's the same thing that they found with creating
the physical one-stop centers. I think the initial assumption
was that the students who were on campus, living in dormitories,
would prefer to deal with someone face-to-face. But then,
what they have found is that 70% of those students would rather
be in the dorm, in the library, at home, in a self-service
environment doing their services.
Slide: Thank you for joining us
PAT: Very interesting.
Are there any other questions for Darlene? Well, thank you
very much for joining us and we look forward to seeing you
on November 14th when we focus on academic advising.
DARLENE: Any ideas on
e-distribution of homework and exams? Well, I've been more
on the services side, Pat. Do you have anything on the eDistribution
of homework and exams?
PAT: No. I'm afraid
I don't. But maybe someone in the audience does.
DARLENE: Well, Catherine,
if you're looking for state-wide services, take a look at
that North Carolina website that I'm going back to get that.
That was CFNC.org. It's for financials and it's state-wide
and it's just excellent. So that would be a good example of
state-wide. And the other example of good state-wide would
be the University of Texas application for admission. And
that's hosted by UT Austin. But that gets into the transcripts,
and some of the things. I know you're already doing that in
Arizona. And I'm not sure where the differences are on that.
We haven't talked about courseware yet, such as Blackboard.
Do you have any comments on the courseware, Pat?
PAT: No, I was still
thinking a little bit about the question about the state-wide
efforts. There are certainly efforts underway in a number
of states to create state-wide services and we had a number
of people here from Alaska earlier and I know they're working
on that. They might want to comment about what they're doing.
Also there are some efforts there. And perhaps Gary Kleemann
or others from Arizona can tell a little bit about what they're
doing. There've been some regional efforts, as well. Been
some efforts like in Ohio for providing library services at
the state level. So there are a number of initiatives out
there for providing services at the state-wide level. Many
of those are still in the beginning stages. One you might
want to look at is Kentucky Virtual University. They have
some efforts and I don't know if Pam McBrayne is still on,
but she might want to comment on that.
I can tell you a little bit about a project that we have
underway that — while we're looking for questions here,
and it a new project, it's going to be funded by the Tulip
Foundation, and one of the aspects of it is to evaluate products
and services that support student services, and it will be
a Web-based tool that will help institutions compare different
products that are out there to support student services, or
if the institution would prefer to outsource a particular
student service, to look at and compare different services
by different service providers. So that was just started in
the development and that'll probably be a year before we have
that up and running. But it's something to keep in mind. I
wonder if Dan would like to comment. Dan Volchok from WebCT
talked about offering tutoring and office hours and orientation
through various courseware packages that Dan might want to
say a little bit more about what he's thinking about there.
One of the other Hewlett projects is one which will compare
the various features of the different courseware management
systems that are out on the market. So that's another site
to keep in mind. Certainly, when we began our last project,
Darlene, we didn't realize how important the SIS system, the
Student Information System was, in designing the personalized
services that students now expect. And all of the problems
you can run into in terms of authentication and security,
with multiple systems. Because, in our case, we were initially
focused on just the distance students, and a number of institutions
have distance students registered in entirely separate databases.
DARLENE: Yes.
PAT: The records are
separate. And so it really makes for a fairly complex problem
initially.
DARLENE: Well, you know,
that's one of the areas we didn't get into and discuss today.
But when you're thinking about selecting new student administrating
system, there's always a question of the chicken or the egg.
Do you redesign services first or do you select a student
administration system first, and then redesign? But I think
you have to do at least part of the redesign first in terms
of understanding what services you want to be able to provide
the students and how you want them to be able to interact.
Not a complete redesign of processes, but at least the beginning.
Because you need that information when you start to select
your student administrative system.
And you need to be realistic, because there aren't that many
systems out there, and you need to find out the functionality
that they have. But that will help you in the selection because
it's kind of like taking the physical model and implementing
it on the Web and we still have the students do the run-around
on the Web and we still have the internal view and silos.
We do that same thing when we implement a student administrative
system. If we haven't started the thought process and even
some of the action on redesign, we'll end up implementing
the student system with the old traditional model. And then
we'll try to go back and make changes after the fact.
So those institutions that have you know, the opportunity
to choose the sequence, there should be some portion of redesign
so that they understand what they want to be able to do, then
assess the administrative systems to see what functions are
available, so that whey they implement that system they'll
at least implement it with an eye to the new redesign.
PAT: Good point.
SUE: Right. And this
is when the return on investment becomes so important, because
you're talking about significant expenditures.
PAT: Well, you are redesigning
the student information system.
DARLENE: And if you're
going to spend that kind of money on a new student information
system, you really want to be able to deliver more than just
the traditional transactions. And you want to be able to do
more than just the way you have already been conducting business.
So it's really important to think of those other elements,
of how you're going to change and what you need to add. And
then, if those systems will all support it. And then how you
would implement those as you begin that new system.
SUE: Yeah... well, looks
like our chat box has slowed down. Now would be the time if
anybody else has comments to make or questions to pose to
Pat or Darlene.
DARLENE: I'll add my
email, so if anyone wants to email me anything, they'll have
that in the chat box.
PAT: Sounds good. And
I think it looks like there are a number of people with an
interest in the topic of orientation, so we may have that
as a topic in the spring, so be on the lookout for that.
SUE: And I noticed one
comment, and probably about the middle of the presentation,
someone requested specifically hearing more about online advising.
I was, like, oh, yes. We just happen to have that subject
next in our webcast series.
DARLENE: What's the
date of your next webcast?
PAT: The next webcast
is November 14th.
SUE: It will also be
at noon, Mountain Time.
PAT: We'll have Mike
Leonard here.
DARLENE: Well, it looks
like there are no more questions.
PAT: Darlene, thank
you again for taking the time to do this today, and provide
your expertise and light conversation to answer everyone's
questions.
DARLENE: Well, you're
welcome. It was very enjoyable. It's nice to experience the
electronic exchange of ideas and also how we're going to start
delivering the education. So it was a good experience. Thank
you very much for including me.
PAT: And thank you,
Sue, for getting this all organized and participating today
and keeping your eye on the questions from the audience.
SUE: You're welcome.
Thank you, Pat.
PAT: We'll see you again
on the 14th of November. Thank you very much.
|